Jam Band drummers?

Discussion:

Jam Band drummers?

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Quadricept

2003-10-16 03:20:02 UTC

Hey all-
What do Jam Band drummers play? I'm primarily into prog rock and jazz fusion.
Looks like I may be asked to join a local jam band and they asked me at the
audition if I knew who Jon Fishman was. Well I had only because of last Month's
DRUM magazine. I know this type of music includes extended solos and a free
jazz sort or mentality. Am I out of line pulling out the occasional Peart fill
or maybe even a double bass pattern? is it expected that you "go out" some or
is the drummer primarily straight time and security for the solo sections?
Any suggested listening? Who is considered cutting edge?
Thanks!
***
"Yo, play faster" -Thomas Hannum
"underwater fight scenes are the drum solos of movies" -Servo
Lula's Birthmark - Original. Lyrical. www.lula's-birthmark.com

Sam Savoca

2003-10-16 13:10:58 UTC

Permalink

Post by Quadricept
Hey all-
What do Jam Band drummers play? I'm primarily into prog rock and jazz fusion.
Looks like I may be asked to join a local jam band and they asked me at the
audition if I knew who Jon Fishman was. Well I had only because of last Month's
DRUM magazine. I know this type of music includes extended solos and a free
jazz sort or mentality. Am I out of line pulling out the occasional Peart fill
or maybe even a double bass pattern? is it expected that you "go out" some or
is the drummer primarily straight time and security for the solo sections?
Any suggested listening? Who is considered cutting edge?
Thanks!

I gigged and recorded with a "jamband" for three years. It can actually be
*any* kind of music at all with various genres sometimes being played in one
song as long as the players are 60's hippy wannabees.

Seriously, just keep your ears wide open, listen for cues and changes, bone
up on all kinds of signatures, hang with the bass player (except for the
long tedious bass solos), use dynamics, have fun.

Sam S.

Squakgobbler

2003-10-16 13:59:47 UTC

Permalink

Post by Quadricept

Post by Quadricept
Hey all-
What do Jam Band drummers play? I'm primarily into prog rock and jazz

fusion.

Post by Quadricept
Looks like I may be asked to join a local jam band and they asked me at

the

Post by Quadricept
audition if I knew who Jon Fishman was. Well I had only because of last

Month's

Post by Quadricept
DRUM magazine. I know this type of music includes extended solos and a

free

Post by Quadricept
jazz sort or mentality. Am I out of line pulling out the occasional

Peart

Post by Quadricept
fill

Post by Quadricept
or maybe even a double bass pattern? is it expected that you "go out"

some

Post by Quadricept
or

Post by Quadricept
is the drummer primarily straight time and security for the solo sections?
Any suggested listening? Who is considered cutting edge?
Thanks!

I gigged and recorded with a "jamband" for three years. It can actually be
*any* kind of music at all with various genres sometimes being played in one
song as long as the players are 60's hippy wannabees.
Seriously, just keep your ears wide open, listen for cues and changes, bone
up on all kinds of signatures, hang with the bass player (except for the
long tedious bass solos), use dynamics, have fun.
Sam S.

And Jon Fishman rocks my world!

Erich

2003-10-16 15:14:36 UTC

Permalink

They're all over the board like any other genre. I would go out and
get some live recordings of:
Grateful Dead - One From The Vault or a Dick's Picks (look for shows
AFTER 1977)

moe. - Vinny is a tremendous drummer, Jim an aux percussion adds nice
spice. They have a couple official live releases. Get one.

Phish - Avoid "A Live One" as it's from an era when Phish was more...
"angular." Their jamming style became more "organic" around 1998+.
They have several live disks out, and downloads available on
www.livephish.com. Fishman is one ambidextrous mo-fo.

Medeski, Martin & Wood - Shack Man. (Studio) Even if you don't join
the band. BUY THAT.

One thing that makes jam band tough is: poor listeners. Everybody in
the band needs to listen. If you have people in the band who are self
indulgent (ie - 5 minute guitar solos that aren't inventive!) the
music will suck. Jam bands are the GOLDEN when they click, but are
the WORST CRAP EVER when they suck. - And even good bands have CRAP
nights. -

Erich Smith

groove_sf

2003-10-16 18:01:08 UTC

Permalink

Post by Quadricept
What do Jam Band drummers play? I'm primarily into prog rock and jazz fusion.
Looks like I may be asked to join a local jam band and they asked me at the
audition if I knew who Jon Fishman was. Well I had only because of last Month's
DRUM magazine. I know this type of music includes extended solos and a free
jazz sort or mentality. Am I out of line pulling out the occasional Peart fill

FWIW - I used to play in a "jam band". Of course, that doesn't mean
squat since "Jam Band" is really a catch-all term that covers a lot of
different styles. Yes, there is a lot of improvisation, but I think
that what is extended is not drum solos but the whole song. The whole
groove is extended. Most of the stuff I played were fairly funky,
syncopated grooves. Often we would all go off into la-la-land but it
was usually as a band. I rarely soloed. What we did do a lot was
your typical jam-band dynamic build-up around an instrumental solo.

I would say that most of the "jam band" music I hear is actually
pretty far from free-jazz. If I would equate it with any kind of jazz
it would be with "soul jazz".

(Granted, the Grateful Dead did have a lot of extended drum solos, but
I don't think that's typical in jam bands these days).

My $0.02.

Sam Savoca

2003-10-16 18:59:51 UTC

Permalink

Post by groove_sf

FWIW - I used to play in a "jam band". Of course, that doesn't mean
squat since "Jam Band" is really a catch-all term that covers a lot of
different styles. Yes, there is a lot of improvisation, but I think
that what is extended is not drum solos but the whole song. The whole
groove is extended. Most of the stuff I played were fairly funky,
syncopated grooves. Often we would all go off into la-la-land but it
was usually as a band. I rarely soloed. What we did do a lot was
your typical jam-band dynamic build-up around an instrumental solo.
I would say that most of the "jam band" music I hear is actually
pretty far from free-jazz. If I would equate it with any kind of jazz
it would be with "soul jazz".
(Granted, the Grateful Dead did have a lot of extended drum solos, but
I don't think that's typical in jam bands these days).
My $0.02.

I used to do at least two solos a show. The guitarist would just look over
at me and nod. I'd give it about 8 - 12 bars then hit a signature end for
the reentry. It was always in different places.

Sam S.

Kevin Frey

2003-10-16 19:03:14 UTC

Permalink

Hey man. My first band experience, when I was in high school, was a
Grateful dead cover band. We would learn full sets from live bootleg
tapes and then use that as an outline for what ultimately became our own
jams on the tunes that we picked to play. The key to playing in a "jam
band" situation is LISTENING!!! First off, being comfortable with as
many different musical styles as possible and rhythmic possibilities as
possible help immensly. You need to be able to travel through the music
collectively, the whole band, to unknown places. If you think too much
and try too hard to plan out certain ideas for fills or grooves that you
want to force into the music, then everything will fall apart. If you
are very familiar with "progressive rock," like King Crimson, Yes,
Earthworks, etc, and "fusion" jazz, like Weather Report, Mahivishnu
Orchestra, Pat Metheny, Mike Stern, John Scofield, Return To Forever,
etc, then you should have some idea of how to jam over a song form or a
set of harmonic changes. You want to be free, but not free of tempo or
time keeping. Just like in any form of improvised music, your first, and
most important, job is to support the music. Once a groove is
established, you only need to listen to everyone else in the band and
feel your way through the song. If you hear the bass player hinting at a
latin-type groove, then go with it, or if the guitarist starts playing
some real funky kind of rhythm, go with it. Listen and react to what is
happening. And, occasionally, you can be the one who steers the band
into a certain musical direction, but never force it. Good luck, man!
-Kevin

Kirt Wingard

2003-10-17 06:15:15 UTC

Permalink

I saw John Blackwell play for almost four hours without taking a break in
Monterrey Jack's one night. He put together a jazz/funk group for the
local (Columbia, S.C.) Three Rivers Music Festival and this was their only
practice gig. It was awe-inspiring. As they'd end one tune, he and the
bass player would transition into the next one by setting a new groove.

My band had practice tonight and we jammed for about two hours. I set up a
groove and then, listening to each other for cues, we changed almost
seemlessly from rock to latin to funk to fusion to blues and so forth.
I've got to say that my new Ludwig WMP Jazzette set sounded killer and it
was also the first time I used the DW 9000 I bought from Schuh with the
band. Simply stated, it kicks ass. :o)

My advice is to listen to your bandmates and use dynamics. The more you
play with people the easier it is to pick up on changes and predict which
way the song is heading. Be careful not to overplay, especially in the
beginning of a song; if you start out "busy" and loud then it leaves you
nowhere to go. Everbody solo's during a jam but it's important to make
your solo fit the music you're playing. The worst part about jam bands is
if they don't play smart then everything that they play sounds the same.
Just stay in the pocket and use fills tastefully.

/kirt

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DrumSac

2003-10-17 13:18:57 UTC

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Hey, I'm in that issue!

To my ear, there really is no specific jamband genre - the word
"jamband" covers several different styles (funk, folk/bluegrass,
fusion, southern rock, etc.). The only thing that holds them all
together is that the bands all jam a lot - go figure.

So at your audition, you'll just have to use your ears. I suggest you
concentrate primarily on laying down a good foundation for the band
(give 'em a good groove). After that, you'll have to use your
judgement - this group might go pretty far out. Don't be afraid to go
with 'em when appropriate, but you'll have to pick your spots
carefully. If they are a jazz/fusion type of thing, you can let your
chops hang out a bit, but if they're doing a Dead/Allman type of
thing, stick to the groove.

I think your prog rock background can help in a jamband setting. I
used to listen to Genesis, Rush, Yes, etc. The chops that I picked up
from that style have been a great help since I've gotten into funk,
fusion, R&B, etc. The flip-side of that, though, is that most prog
drummers are unbelievably stiff and couldn't swing if they were
hanging from the end of a rope. You've got to make the music feel
good. Jamband fans like to dance, so make it funky.

If you want to really understand jamband drumming (as with any style),
you should check out the roots - Grateful Dead, Allman Bros, Hendrix,
Cream, The Meters, Zappa, electric Miles Davis, etc. Others have
posted some good recommendations too.

One more thing - leave the double-bass pedal home. If you just can't
live without it, then use it sparingly. Hope this helps a little bit.

word
-Sac
www.afroskull.com

Quadricept

2003-10-20 14:48:23 UTC

Permalink

Original poster here! You folks have some GREAT input.My thanks. Will let you
know how things look with them.
Todd
***
"Yo, play faster" -Thomas Hannum
"underwater fight scenes are the drum solos of movies" -Servo
Lula's Birthmark - Original. Lyrical. www.lula's-birthmark.com